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advice needed , i tried else where it did not help #315014
05/07/14 04:27 AM
05/07/14 04:27 AM
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nikivega86 Offline OP
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nikivega86  Offline OP
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I am hoping to get some advice on a dog we are fostering in my job. first let me start by saying this dog grew up with me so to speak , i work at a doggie day care and i own two shepherds my oldest grew up with this shepherd and when i was looking to get a second dog i just so found him on a ebay up for adoption add (free to a good home) and rescued him through my job unfortunately my fiance already bought me a puppy at the same time so i could not take him although my job took him in because we convinced the old owner to give him up to us then put him in a shelter, so now he is at work with us , i took him home and tried to Forster him but he was to aggressive with my girl when it came to food so i had no choice but to brought him back plus with a new puppy i was unsure how he would react almost 5 months has gone by now every person who goes to see him he tries to attack he even ripped a women who was interested in him sweater off , i understand he is unsure of new people he is stressed

and frustrated being there , but he is not locked in a cage all day for the most part he is with people and other dogs but im sure he knows this is not home , he is even becoming aggressive towards staff and myself and i always had a bond with him , he has had obedience training , and is going through it again , i do agility with him , in the second picture is my dog rambo on the left , you can see max on the right with his ribs sticking out , his old parents neglected him so bad he didnt even know what dog food was , they fed him only pop tarts and tv dinners , if i could take him i would , but he has other aggression problems not only in camp but also in the car severely and as well on leash and with kids he growls at them , it breaks my heart everyday , if i could own him i would , he is so sweet under the hurt , i just need advice , im not asking anyone to adopt him just please help me to get his aggression under control or help him feel better or if anyone has been in this type of situation that can help , i know he needs LOVE AND HOME , i loose sleep thinking of him and how unhappy he must be , the pain he feels kills me. Please any one who can offer advice or has been in this situation that can help is all i ask , I did try asking for advice on a fb page and no one helped , they just told me to take him in , unfortunately this is not a option , i have 2 cats and 2 shepherds i can not take him in , if i could trust me i would have already please any advice is welcomed

Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: nikivega86] #315017
05/07/14 05:35 AM
05/07/14 05:35 AM
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Think about this just for a minute - if you an't and don't trust him; how could you ask someone else to trust him with their family?

Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: Codmaster] #315033
05/07/14 01:18 PM
05/07/14 01:18 PM
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nikivega86 Offline OP
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nikivega86  Offline OP
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You think about it for a minute. He's not a perfect dog. He's has basic obedience training but his previous owners never re-enforced anything. He needs a person or couple that has the time, space and experience to save this dog. We would love to but having 2 puppies we already have our hands full. He is trust worthy. if you didn't have anything nice or encouraging to say you really didn't have to say anything.

Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: nikivega86] #315034
05/07/14 02:10 PM
05/07/14 02:10 PM
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Thank you for saving this dog. Yes, you are right, shepherds do not do well in transitional situations like shelters, and this fellow understands that he is not yet "home." Thank you for your understanding of him.

Please get him a vet exam. This is typical when aggression is an issue. In the vet exam, we look for a full thyroid panel, a complete tick disease panel, a very thorough eye exam (GSDs can have vision problems), and a frank discussion with the vet about the aggression.

Regarding his extreme thinness, please address that with the vet, as well as keeping him on a good diet. If he does not respond with appropriate weight gain, if he has loose stool, he'll need a vet exam for EPI, IBD, SIBO, intestinal worms, etc.

Because it sounds like your job has dogs, staff, kids, etc. all doing various things, nobody can focus on creating structure for this dog, and setting him up for success. He needs someone to do that. This situation keeps him warm and dry and fed, but there is no way to keep things calm, predictable, and reassuring for him. He needs to be one person's focus. So, please try the GSD breed rescues in your area. They may be full, but please try.

Thank you for trying to help him. For now, please do what you can to keep his contact with new people and dogs to a minimum. Not all aggression is anxiety, some can be related to pain, dominance, etc. but in his situation, anyone would be anxious. It would also help if whoever is working with him directly is a very calm, stable, reliable person who tends to not get excited easily. Thank you for helping him find peace, love, and a home.


Patti
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Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: nikivega86] #315035
05/07/14 02:17 PM
05/07/14 02:17 PM
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york township, MI
katieliz Offline
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Niki, I am not at all being negative and want to ask you as kindly as I possibly can...seriously...you can honestly say you trust this boy? The way you describe him, it sounds as tho he would be one of those dogs who gets passed around because he is unpredictable. Also, you must know that the rescue and adoption world is totally overloaded and wonderful, adoptable dogs are euthanized every day because there are simply too many. So many times dogs like this boy get scooped up by unscrupulous people who sell them to research or to dog fighters for bait dogs. I think you will have a really, REALLY hard time finding the owner you think he needs and I think you are likely going to have to consider the option that you'd rather not consider. There are much worse things for a dog like this out there than a humane euth. I send this message to you with great caring for these dogs and a big thank you for trying to help him. Maybe someone else has some thoughts on a different solution to the problem. Take care.


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shangri la's great white caesar ("the c-monster")
voodoo lily (dsh)
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Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: katieliz] #315036
05/07/14 02:19 PM
05/07/14 02:19 PM
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york township, MI
katieliz Offline
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Thank you patti, wonderful suggestions and beautifully written as always.

Last edited by katieliz; 05/07/14 02:20 PM.

mom to seraphina blue and the cashman
miss jeni-take-a-ride
shangri la's great white caesar ("the c-monster")
voodoo lily (dsh)
cricket-the-bird (african grey parrot)RIP-2013
RIP hearthside's cinderfella (4/20/09)
RIP shep von bellefontaine (6/9/10)
Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: katieliz] #315051
05/07/14 05:25 PM
05/07/14 05:25 PM
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Forgive me, but I don't understand. This is a dog that your dog played with all it's life and has gone through all kinds of obedience and agility training then suddenly shows up on Ebay as a bag of bones??? That just doesn't make sense to me. Is it possible that he has a medical condition that has caused him to loose weight quickly and perhaps the owners didn't have the funds (or desire) to get Vet care for him?

I wish you the best with him. If I were in your shoes the first place I would go with him is to the Vets.

I can also see why a dog that skinny would have food aggressive issues.

Last edited by Shilohsmom; 05/07/14 05:26 PM.

Rosa

Proud Mom to Eli and Kodiak
and never to be forgotten, Shiloh and Shoshi
Every dog deserves to have a human that thinks its the greatest dog that ever lived!
Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: Braverhund] #315072
05/08/14 04:24 AM
05/08/14 04:24 AM
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nikivega86 Offline OP
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nikivega86  Offline OP
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Thank you so much for your advice , we are working with a rescue through our on site dog trainer which is why he has had a few people come and see him that were interested.But giving him to a rescue right now is not a option. They are over loaded as it is. If we could find him a foster home that would be ideal our only request is that any new owner or foster continues with training with him because he needs it. We do not want to just give him to just anyone. This is why he is still with us.

We have sent a fecal sample to a vet and got it tested because he has had severe diarrhea but this started happening recently and it comes and goes, it came back clear of any parasites , We have been giving him metronidazole, and we have him on Iams dry food , mixed with boiled rice, and pumpkin. I personally do not agree with the choice of dry food but this is what the owner of the facility buys for him. I wish there was more that i could do for him financially , i would love to take him to a vet for a full exam but i have 2 dogs myself, bills up the wazoo, my own struggles. Its all very frustrating for me.

As far as him being severely under weight , it is because his previous owners never gave him a proper diet. Max was purchased at a pet store when he was 3 months old ,They saw a puppy they thought was cute not even knowing anything about the breed the time , money, and work that goes into it and bought him. he started coming to my job around 6 months old , we knew then he had some behavior issues we did our best to try and convince his old owners to feed him a better diet and seek professional training. They sent him away for training but never reinforced it , then with in a few months he stopped coming to my job. We did not hear anything from the owners. I always look at gsds up for adoption. I just so happened to be browsing Ebay classifieds and saw a free to good home add for him. I recognized him right away and contacted his previous owners ,she told me she was considering putting him in a shelter because she did not have time or money to give him what he needs. The owner where i work then got involved convinced her to bring him to us , that we would take him and find him a home. It is by pure luck that i found him. Had i not i am sure he would of been put to sleep already being in a shelter. The day he was dropped off to my job the previous owner was laughing the entire time , took the whole thing like it was one big joke, didn't even show one ounce of emotion. When i saw how severely under weight he had become,it mad me so sick, but i was instructed by my boss to take him straight to the back not even look at her or talk to her. The whole situation was sickening.

I completely agree what he needs is more then anyone in my job can give him. We do the best we can giving him training, walks , once a week obedience classes and once a week agility training but i know its not enough. I don't think any of us anticipated on him being here as long as he has. We just have not found anyone willing to put in the time, training , and love that he needs.

Thank you again for your advice,tomorrow im going to sit down with my boss and seriously talk to him about taking him to a vet for a full exam and working on a more structured regimen for him .

Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: nikivega86] #315074
05/08/14 06:03 AM
05/08/14 06:03 AM
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Originally Posted By: nikivega86
You think about it for a minute. He's not a perfect dog. He's has basic obedience training but his previous owners never re-enforced anything. He needs a person or couple that has the time, space and experience to save this dog. We would love to but having 2 puppies we already have our hands full. He is trust worthy. if you didn't have anything nice or encouraging to say you really didn't have to say anything.


No, I don't need to think about it all. Just trying to suggest something for YOU to think about before you try to rehome such a dog with such a problem!

If you don't care about the next family to get such a dog - then that is soley up to you. Just wondering - will you tell them about the dogs history? or just let them find out themselves?

Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: Codmaster] #315075
05/08/14 06:04 AM
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"every person who goes to see him he tries to attack he even ripped a women who was interested in him sweater off , i understand he is unsure of new people he is stressed"


HHMMM?

Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: Codmaster] #315076
05/08/14 06:16 AM
05/08/14 06:16 AM
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"every person who goes to see him he tries to attack he even ripped a women who was interested in him sweater off , i understand he is unsure of new people he is stressed"


HHMMM?

Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: Codmaster] #315085
05/08/14 01:22 PM
05/08/14 01:22 PM
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I'm so sorry you are in this position. I think you have been trying to do the right thing but fear you may not have the resources you need that may make the difference here.

Hopefully, your boss will let you take him to the Vet for a full check up. Perhaps there would be some answers there.


Rosa

Proud Mom to Eli and Kodiak
and never to be forgotten, Shiloh and Shoshi
Every dog deserves to have a human that thinks its the greatest dog that ever lived!
Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: Codmaster] #315103
05/08/14 05:45 PM
05/08/14 05:45 PM
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If the dog does have something like EPI, he can be way low on his B vitamins, and I believe there is a correlation between low on B vitamins and aggressive behavior. I could be all wet on that though, and the nutrition and health experts will correct me. Thyroid can also cause aggressiveness.

With a full exam and bloodwork, and no physical cause for his aggressive behavior. I'm sorry, I know you know the dog, but rather than leave him in a shelter situation, maybe the best thing to do is to put the boy down before he seriously injures someone. You are training this dog in obedience and agility and he is being aggressive. Usually even dogs behaving badly (usually from lack of exercise and mental stimulation) will bond with the people that feed and actively train them. That's not normal. If it is not a physical problem, then there are a lot of normal dogs out there being put down because there is no room for them, dogs that have a hope of finding a real family, and being adopted.

I'm sorry, I know it is hard.

Last edited by Selzer; 05/08/14 05:47 PM.

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Re: advice needed , i tried else where it did not help [Re: Selzer] #315109
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What she said!


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