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Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: Qyn] #233879
06/02/12 12:29 PM
06/02/12 12:29 PM
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PositiveDog Offline
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Just this... grouphug for you and Cooper. I hope when they take a look Monday things begin to get better for you.


Bonnie

With approval of my friends:

SamCat, 03/2011
Bennie the 12 1/2% GSD 02/2013

Seiko, Solo, Sophie, Skye and Buddy - bridge dogs who taught me so much
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: Qyn] #233886
06/02/12 02:02 PM
06/02/12 02:02 PM
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Northern CA
MaxaLisa Offline

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Originally Posted By: Qyn
Bianca, everyone knows you only have Cooper's best interest at heart - he and Molly could not have a better owner. Plus, it is all too easy for any of us to get on the internet and search for answers or alternative treatments when it seems Cooper is not getting better but that is because we care about Cooper and we care about you .

Yes, this grouphug

DMSO is used a lot in horses, it's actually a solvent. I've used it when I had a swollen knee that responded to about nothing. It can be harsh, but it's effective; I'd just use it very carfully and sparingly, but I would be cautious near any open wound. It can carry things into the skin too - in an episode of NCIS I think they used it as a carrier to administer poison wink I find that I can't use it regularly, but do use it occassionally - I buy it with a rolltop for application at the health food store, but feed stores probably carry it too.

Haven't a clue if any of the alternatives work, but I was looking for different perspectives, since he doesn't seem to be progressing. One of those links talks about the surgery, that they've done it, it's not the end of the world, it worked, but, gosh, sure would be nice if that could be avoided.

Just hopeing for the best for you guys. hugging


MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

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Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: MaxaLisa] #233904
06/02/12 05:23 PM
06/02/12 05:23 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,452
New Milford, CT
Woodreb Online coffee
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Some uses of DMSO in the medical field: Dimethylsulfoxide (DMSO)

However - be aware that it is not with toxicity issues:

Section 11: Toxicological Information
Routes of Entry: Absorbed through skin. Eye contact. Inhalation.
Toxicity to Animals:
Acute oral toxicity (LD50): 7920 mg/kg [Mouse]. Acute dermal toxicity (LD50): 40000 mg/kg [Rat].
Chronic Effects on Humans:
MUTAGENIC EFFECTS: Mutagenic for mammalian somatic cells. Mutagenic for bacteria and/or yeast. May cause damage to
the following organs: blood, kidneys, liver, mucous membranes, skin, eyes.
Other Toxic Effects on Humans:
Slightly hazardous in case of inhalation (lung irritant). Slightly hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant, permeator), of
ingestion, .
Special Remarks on Toxicity to Animals: Not available.
Special Remarks on Chronic Effects on Humans:
May cause adverse reproductive effects (female fertility and fetotoxicity - post implantation mortality) and birth defects based
on animal data. May cause cancer (tumorigenic) based on animal data. May affect genetic material (mutagenic).
Special Remarks on other Toxic Effects on Humans:
Acute Potential Health Effects: Skin: Causes skin irritation. May cause urticaria(hives), skin rashes, and dermatitis. Dimethyl
Sulfoxide is readily absorbed through skin and may carry other dissolved chemicals into the body. An unusual garliconion-
oyster odor may develop on breath and body/skin. Absorption through skin may also cause diarrhea, and affect
respiration(dyspnea, cyanosis), blood, behavior (fatigue, dizziness, sedation, headaches), vision (transient photophobia,
and disturbances of color vision), urinary system (hematuria). Eyes: Causes eye irritation. May cause blurred vision,
corneal opacity, chemical conjunctivitis. Inhalation: Causes respiratory tract irritation. Symptoms from exposure to high
vapor concentrations may include coughing, shortness of breath, headache, dizziness and sedation. Ingestion: Causes
gastrointestinal tract irritation, and an usual garlic-onion-oyster may develop on breath, and body/skin. May affect behavior/
central nervous system, respiration (dyspnea). Symptoms may include nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea, abdominal pain,
drowsiness, confusion, lethargy, agitation, disorientation, tremor, muscle weakness, chills, chest pains. May also affect liver
(elevated liver enzymes, jaundice), cardiovascular system, and urinary system (hematuria, hemoglobinuria, renal tubular
injury), eyes (transient photophobia and disturbances of color vision, conjunctive irritation) Chronic Potential Health Effects:
Skin: Chronic absorption may cause effects similar to that of acute skin absorption. Chronic skin contact may cause scaling

from DMSO MSDS

I used it a few years ago for a skin infection that Rica in her last year, as a prescribed treatment from her vet. Please just be aware that there are some toxicity issues with using this chemical for long term exposures.

I have no suggestions for you, but am sending good thoughts to Cooper that something can be done to help him with this.

Last edited by Woodreb; 06/02/12 05:24 PM.

Johanna

Caleb (aka Caleb-Moose)
Ciara(aka Ciara Belle, Black Devil)

RIP Aodhán, Rica, Max, Kelly - gone but never forgotten - forever in my heart
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: Woodreb] #233954
06/03/12 01:13 AM
06/03/12 01:13 AM
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Posts: 19,487
Northern CA
MaxaLisa Offline

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Johanna, how did you apply the DMSO?

Based on my experience with my knee, I didn't need much of it, and wouldn't use it a lot.


MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: MaxaLisa] #233963
06/03/12 01:33 AM
06/03/12 01:33 AM
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New Milford, CT
Woodreb Online coffee
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Lisa,

From what I remember, we just dampened a gauze pad and rub it on her skin. I think it was actually a carrier for a medicine, but it's been long enough that I don't remember exactly what was done. I don't think you want to use very much, nor would I want to use it very long. I think it was a week long thing for Rica, once a day.

We use this chemical as a solvent for a fair amount of the GC work that we do, testing for residual solvents and always glove up since we're using relatively large volumes of the stuff at a time.


Johanna

Caleb (aka Caleb-Moose)
Ciara(aka Ciara Belle, Black Devil)

RIP Aodhán, Rica, Max, Kelly - gone but never forgotten - forever in my heart
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: Woodreb] #233996
06/03/12 05:30 AM
06/03/12 05:30 AM
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Northern CA
MaxaLisa Offline

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I have a healthy respect for it, but I do know it helped when nothing else did. Weird stuff, thanks for the info!


MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
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Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: Qyn] #234010
06/03/12 12:17 PM
06/03/12 12:17 PM
Joined: May 2010
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Queensland. Australia
bianca Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Qyn
Bianca, everyone knows you only have Cooper's best interest at heart - he and Molly could not have a better owner. Plus, it is all too easy for any of us to get on the internet and search for answers or alternative treatments when it seems Cooper is not getting better but that is because we care about Cooper and we care about you - but only you and your vets are there on the spot so no doubt have a better viewpoint.

Having had a scientific background, I probably often tend to see and write things clinically first but I certainly don't mean to be as critical as I can appear to be and that is one reason why I choose not to post in certain threads - sorry if anything I have said has upset you. hugging


Oh Alison, no, no, no! Nothing you or anybody else have ever said has upset me hugging I so appreciate everything that has been mentioned. I would be totally lost without you all. Please do not ever not reply for fear of upsetting me!

I am just so frustrated with this all but not any of you hugging


Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: bianca] #234011
06/03/12 12:25 PM
06/03/12 12:25 PM
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Queensland. Australia
bianca Offline OP
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Thank you Bonnie, and Johanna for that info, and Lisa hugging

I think I will not look further into that...it looks too scary for me to feel comfortable with. Knowing my luck, Cooper or Moo would lick it off and get really sick!

I have to meet the firewood man at the new house tomorrow morning so hopefully can get Cooper into the vet. With the dew on the grass until after lunch and then todays constant rain, his bandage is getting wet and manky so am changing it twice daily frown I can't put a plastic bag over it as he wants to eat it!

Today back to fashionable red smile and wondering what all the fuss is about.



Once again, thank you all hugging


Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: bianca] #234045
06/03/12 03:52 PM
06/03/12 03:52 PM
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JeanKBBMMMAAN Offline
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Weird thought - could there be autoimmune aspect to this stuff??? Reading through this it almost sounds like even if no one with...uh, one of those pesky medical degrees has said it (that we have found - maybe someone has) that maybe the whole body overreacting this is a sign of a vague AID???? Like puppy strangles is...

So like...would an immune suppressing dose of something like Prednisilone work I wonder - something for people to ask their vets as like a strange thought that you can blame on an internet weirdo. laugh

Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: JeanKBBMMMAAN] #234054
06/03/12 05:07 PM
06/03/12 05:07 PM
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Northern CA
MaxaLisa Offline

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Originally Posted By: JeanKBBMMMAAN
Weird thought - could there be autoimmune aspect to this stuff??? Reading through this it almost sounds like even if no one with...uh, one of those pesky medical degrees has said it (that we have found - maybe someone has) that maybe the whole body overreacting this is a sign of a vague AID????

This has been my thought all along, except I would go for the CMO, protelytic enzymes as antiinflammatories, etc.


MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: MaxaLisa] #234091
06/03/12 11:49 PM
06/03/12 11:49 PM
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Queensland. Australia
bianca Offline OP
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Thank you Jean and Lisa hugging

I am taking him into the vets in half an hour (not sure if they will sedate him to remove the drains) but I will ask re the possibility of AID. Thank you smile

The firewood supplier was early so didn't have time to do anything with Coop and just got home and he had exposed the drains and was licking them madly. So I'm not sure if they are itchy (stitches) or painful or both.

Lisa I have ordered the 2 supplements you suggested in the other thread but overseas shipping takes 6-8 weeks apparently so am still waiting! But currently he gets Vit C, fish oil, vit E and Glucosamine, and probiotics.


Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: bianca] #234099
06/04/12 12:53 AM
06/04/12 12:53 AM
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Queensland. Australia
bianca Offline OP
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Just dropped him off as they are going to sedate him again. I only spoke to the vet nurse but she is not aware of anyone who does acupunture (which is what I discovered via Google). She said there was a vet about an hour and a half away who used to but she doesn't think she practices anymore.

So she has made a note to ask the 2 vets there if they know of anyone and also if there is a chance this could be an AID issue.


Molly Moo (aka The Piranha, 4 legged mouth) GSD (31/10/09)
Cooper GSD (The Gremlin) 19/10/11
Texas - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free sweet Teppie
Paris - Tabby cat (Feb 1996-2013) Run free my beautiful girl.
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: bianca] #234110
06/04/12 02:43 AM
06/04/12 02:43 AM
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BowWowMeow Offline
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Bianca,

Where are you now? Maybe we can help find someone?


Ruth

Rafi, the german malaroo, age 9.5ish
http://www.dogster.com/dogs/693238

Varda & Gio (the crazy cattens)
...............
Warming my heart:
Queen Cleopatra
Chama
Kai
Basu
Massie
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: BowWowMeow] #234122
06/04/12 06:59 AM
06/04/12 06:59 AM
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Northern CA
MaxaLisa Offline

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How frustrating on the shipping. Wonder if I could have got them there sooner frown

Don't remember the second supplement, will have to go look!

Yes, maybe we can help look for an acu vet. You can always pm the location.


MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/
Re: Help! How do I bandage an elbow properly? [Re: MaxaLisa] #234123
06/04/12 07:10 AM
06/04/12 07:10 AM
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MaxaLisa Offline

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Found it: http://germanshepherdhome.net/forum/ubbt...bows#Post225129

Okay, the bioflavanoids will help with any eosinophilic reaction, 1 capsule twice a day, and they will supplement the vit C that you are giving. Thet won't be enough to "reset" anything, but will support. Might be able to find something equivalent over there if he continues to be an allergice response boy.

The CMO is our big hope. At high doses, it should reset inflammatory, autoimmune type processes. If vet thinks autoimmune, he will probably try steroids before your mail comes.


MaxaL (aka LisaT)

Jazmine, mini-mix, 10/18/2011
Max-n-Indy
Max, 5/2001-2/2012, RIP my partner, my Regal Boy
Indy, 5/1997-10/2010, RIP my friend, my teacher

Health Index
K9 TBD info and Tick List Links
http://www.rabieschallengefund.org/
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