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Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: LifeAsMe] #114731
12/14/10 07:28 PM
12/14/10 07:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,061
Michigan, USA
Chris Wild Offline
Administrator... and Alpha Bitch of the Wild Bunch
Chris Wild  Offline
Administrator... and Alpha Bitch of the Wild Bunch
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,061
Michigan, USA
We tried the HA and also collagen with Kali for her spondylosis, and saw absolutely no difference. Put Nara on it at the same time, and saw no difference with her either. So we quit using them as they seemed a complete waste of money, at least for these 2 dogs. Though of course all dogs are different and they might help other dogs. I'd just recommend just starting with the basics, and tweaking from there only if needed.

Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: Chris Wild] #114732
12/14/10 07:33 PM
12/14/10 07:33 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,264
CNY
GSDElsa Offline OP
Veteran
GSDElsa  Offline OP
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,264
CNY
Thanks for the advice and good words guys! I'm really irritated with myself right now. We were going to get this done a good 6 months ago when she hit her imaginary 2nd birthday and life just kind of piled up and we put it off. I feel like I cheated her out of 6 months of a better approach to maintain it. ARGH with myself right now!


J, mom to:
- Elsa - BrightStar Rescue - "Da Pookins"
- Medo - "The Beast From The East"

Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: GSDElsa] #114734
12/14/10 07:37 PM
12/14/10 07:37 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 3,033
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LifeAsMe Offline
Carpal Tunnel
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You shouldn't feel like that Justine. Did the vet say if there were any signs of arthritis yet? She's not showing any discomfort so she's obviously not in pain. You keep her in sports, you exercise her, hike with her. All that is keeping her muscles strong and helping her hips.

Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: Chris Wild] #114735
12/14/10 07:38 PM
12/14/10 07:38 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 622
Rensselaer County, NY
DnP Offline
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DnP  Offline
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Rensselaer County, NY
Here are some chiros off of the AVCA site who are in NY and closer to you:

Kelly Foltman DVM Manlius NY 315-682-6434 KSFDVM@windstream.net
Lisa Bancroft DVM Canton NY 315-386-2754
Heather Beaudry-St. Germain DC, LVT Rochester NY 585-663-4262 beaudrystgermain@yahoo.com


Here are practicing graduates from the Chi Institute (Traditional Chinese Veterinary Medicine)who practice closer to you (though not all that close). This is where both my holistic vet and regular vet went.

Kirsten Anderson, DVM
Specialty: Small Animal, Equine
Watertown, NY 13601, USA
Tele: (315)785-8000

Heather Culbertson, DVM, CVA
Specialty: Small Animal, Exotic
Mendon, NY 14506, USA
Tele: (585)624-2240

PS, you asked before about Phoenix's picture. My niece thought he needed to get in touch with his feminine side and needed to wear her pink tutu around his neck. He didn't seem to mind.


Last edited by DnP; 12/14/10 07:40 PM.

Diana

Bentley...the light that brought me out of the darkness.

RIP Phoenix (Brightstar rescue) 2006 - 5/6/2017
RIP Dakota 1/5/1993 - 10/23/2006
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: DnP] #114737
12/14/10 07:47 PM
12/14/10 07:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,748
Buffalo
BowWowMeow Offline
Carpal Tunnel
BowWowMeow  Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,748
Buffalo
The cost of the Longevity is why I use both the Joint Health chewables combined with Longevity. The buy 2, get 1 free deal is always on. Occasionally they also have buy 2, get 2 free or some additional percentage off. If Elsa can't tolerate the fish oil I would use flax. Lisa T uses ground flax seeds, I think.

I feed Rafi ground raw so it's easy to mix in the Longevity. If you want you could start with the Joint Health chewables and then wait to use the Longevity until she gets older. Rafi's joints were such a mess when I adopted him then I decided to start with the super powered stuff. Now you can't even tell he has any issues.

And don't beat yourself up! Most people wouldn't have even gotten x-rays in the first place!


Ruth

Rafi, the german malaroo, age 9.5ish
http://www.dogster.com/dogs/693238

Varda & Gio (the crazy cattens)
...............
Warming my heart:
Queen Cleopatra
Chama
Kai
Basu
Massie
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: BowWowMeow] #114749
12/14/10 08:21 PM
12/14/10 08:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,618
JeanKBBMMMAAN Offline
Rescues Rule Admin
JeanKBBMMMAAN  Offline
Rescues Rule Admin
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,618
www.thera-vet.com and they are to the east of Rochester.

Cannot say enough good about them! Tell 'em Jean and Bella sent ya (I want to get some kind of referral bonus someday - I wish they did them)!

Though like Chris, I have dogs x-rayed as having mild-moderate HD who have not yet realized it through exercise and supplements. Though Ava is on a diet now. Again. And Ilsa was severe, so we cut her (femoral) head off. wink

Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: DnP] #114753
12/14/10 08:30 PM
12/14/10 08:30 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,264
CNY
GSDElsa Offline OP
Veteran
GSDElsa  Offline OP
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,264
CNY
Originally Posted By: DnP

Kelly Foltman DVM Manlius NY 315-682-6434 KSFDVM@windstream.net
Lisa Bancroft DVM Canton NY 315-386-2754
Heather Beaudry-St. Germain DC, LVT Rochester NY 585-663-4262 beaudrystgermain@yahoo.com

Kirsten Anderson, DVM
Specialty: Small Animal, Equine
Watertown, NY 13601, USA
Tele: (315)785-8000

Heather Culbertson, DVM, CVA
Specialty: Small Animal, Exotic
Mendon, NY 14506, USA
Tele: (585)624-2240

PS, you asked before about Phoenix's picture. My niece thought he needed to get in touch with his feminine side and needed to wear her pink tutu around his neck. He didn't seem to mind.



Hmmm. Kelly is a horse vet. She was actually my equine vet before the old man went to greener pastures (literally not figurative). I never considered that she might do chiro on dogs, I guess I'll have to touch base with her. AND she used to be on the far south side of Cazenovia, so it looks like she's closer now!

Most are still an hour-ish away plus it looks like. Not too bad of a drive just a crappy time of year to try and get in with a vet that isn't a quick drive...at least with the way our winter is going this year so far.


J, mom to:
- Elsa - BrightStar Rescue - "Da Pookins"
- Medo - "The Beast From The East"

Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: GSDElsa] #114757
12/14/10 08:48 PM
12/14/10 08:48 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,897
L
Lexi Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Lexi  Offline
Carpal Tunnel
L
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,897
As far as advice goes, I got nothin'; I will leave that to all of the other knowledgeable people here. I just wanted to say that I'm sorry Elsa is going through this, but it seems like you will be doing all of the right things to keep her going down the best possible pathway to good health! You're a good doggy mom, don't beat yourself up.

Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: Lexi] #114760
12/14/10 08:57 PM
12/14/10 08:57 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,203
Alabama
aubie Offline
Pooh-Bah
aubie  Offline
Pooh-Bah
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,203
Alabama
Anna's hips are fair, one side is worse than the other. She's on Ester C, fishoil/vit e and Longevity. She's on the thin/trim side. That's about all we can do. But after seeing the effects of the above supps on our older boy who does have arthritis, it's a good route IMHO.


Tiffany mom to:
Anna, GSD 9/21/08
Panzer, GSD 9/12/15
Duncan Dog RIP 2/99-10/15
Danger Kitties: Mia & Winston RIP Alley Cat 10/12, Simon 6/13
Andon two-legger
Anna's Dog Blog: www.annathegsd.blogspot.com
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: aubie] #114766
12/14/10 09:27 PM
12/14/10 09:27 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,662
McAlester, OK
Kayos Offline

Can't Figure Tech Stuff Out
Kayos  Offline

Can't Figure Tech Stuff Out
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,662
McAlester, OK
I have gone from using the Springtime stuff to the human over the counter joint supplements. Not because I dislike Springtime, but Havoc is allergic to an ingredient in both the joint health and longevity.

On the HD, so sorry to hear that! It is distressing but treat the dog not the x-ray. When Kayos was x-rayed at 15 months before we got serious about agility, the vet recommended putting her down as her hips were so bad. We were just gut shot and stunned. Her breeder was really upset and begged us to get a second opinion before we acted (we would NOT have PTS her!) We went toe vet school and repeated the films. The views were better but the diagnosis was not. Kayos was almost 5 before she showed any signs of problems. She had a THR on her right at 5 1/2. Now we use weight control, supplements and hydrotherapy to keep her strong and fit. She gets an occasional Tramadol when she over does the squirrel chasing. I expect her to live 13 years!

Good care, weight management, judicious exercise and therapy and she may never miss a step.


Kathy

PTE,AC,URO3,AG2,UCD Xtra!Xtra! v. TeMar CDX,GN,RE,CGC,TC,HIC, Bh "Havoc" 6/4/07
PAM, URO3, UCD, UACH Tidmores Rising Star Lydia "Mayhem" CD,BN,RE,AX,AJP,OFP,P1J,CA,DN,HT,TKN,TC,CGCA 4/4/12

Lucky, Wolf, Max, Kayos - gone not forgotten. gsdhalo
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: GSDElsa] #114780
12/14/10 09:41 PM
12/14/10 09:41 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 622
Rensselaer County, NY
DnP Offline
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DnP  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 622
Rensselaer County, NY
Originally Posted By: GSDElsa
Originally Posted By: DnP

Kelly Foltman DVM Manlius NY 315-682-6434 KSFDVM@windstream.net
Lisa Bancroft DVM Canton NY 315-386-2754
Heather Beaudry-St. Germain DC, LVT Rochester NY 585-663-4262 beaudrystgermain@yahoo.com

Kirsten Anderson, DVM
Specialty: Small Animal, Equine
Watertown, NY 13601, USA
Tele: (315)785-8000

Heather Culbertson, DVM, CVA
Specialty: Small Animal, Exotic
Mendon, NY 14506, USA
Tele: (585)624-2240

PS, you asked before about Phoenix's picture. My niece thought he needed to get in touch with his feminine side and needed to wear her pink tutu around his neck. He didn't seem to mind.



Hmmm. Kelly is a horse vet. She was actually my equine vet before the old man went to greener pastures (literally not figurative). I never considered that she might do chiro on dogs, I guess I'll have to touch base with her. AND she used to be on the far south side of Cazenovia, so it looks like she's closer now!

Most are still an hour-ish away plus it looks like. Not too bad of a drive just a crappy time of year to try and get in with a vet that isn't a quick drive...at least with the way our winter is going this year so far.


When I saw the addresses, I knew you were looking at an hour plus drive to each. And yeah, I know at this time of year, an hour plus can EASILY be two hours.

BTW, please quit beating yourself up about the timing of getting Elsa's hips x-rayed. Be relieved that you did them NOW when she isn't showing symptoms. Think of yourself being ahead of the game!

In fact, you now have me seriously thinking about getting Phoenix's done. I bet a lot of vets never make the recommendation to get hip x-rays of rescues unless they are showing symptoms.

And sending you a hug as well. Know you want the best for your Elsiepookins.


Diana

Bentley...the light that brought me out of the darkness.

RIP Phoenix (Brightstar rescue) 2006 - 5/6/2017
RIP Dakota 1/5/1993 - 10/23/2006
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: DnP] #114782
12/14/10 09:46 PM
12/14/10 09:46 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 6,713
NY
GSDTrain Offline
Carpal Tunnel
GSDTrain  Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 6,713
NY
Poor Elsa frown

Ivy's hips are really bad, some of the worst hips I've seen, and some of the worst some of the board members have seen. Even though they are both very severe, the one side is worse than the other. She's on Vitamin C, fish oil/vit e and Cosequin DS, and she is doing really well on these supplements and its been almost 8 months.


~Ashley~

Ivy's VV Marie NTD CGC

Mason Von Holley BH ETD ATD ITD NTD CL1R NJN TT TDI HIT CGC (HOT) OFA (H/E/C/L) CERF

UKC CH SG Falcon PacHaus BH AD CGCA TDI
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: DnP] #114784
12/14/10 09:50 PM
12/14/10 09:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 622
Rensselaer County, NY
DnP Offline
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DnP  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 622
Rensselaer County, NY
I have access to an Omega 3 supplament that you may want to try if Elsa doesn't do well on fish oil. My brother's dog has the same issues and he can take this with no problems. It must be introduced slowly and at low doses to begin with. Recommended by my holistic vet.

Here it is:

Ulta EFA by RX Vitamins for Pets:

Ultra EFA


Diana

Bentley...the light that brought me out of the darkness.

RIP Phoenix (Brightstar rescue) 2006 - 5/6/2017
RIP Dakota 1/5/1993 - 10/23/2006
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: DnP] #114792
12/14/10 10:36 PM
12/14/10 10:36 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,465
New Milford, CT
Woodreb Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Woodreb  Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,465
New Milford, CT
We use the Springtime Longetivity for Aodhán. She gets two scoops twice a day and that gives her ~ 1500 mg of the gluocsamine per day. She weighs ~ 75 pounds. I'm not sure how fast we go through the supplement because I bought the buy 2 get 2 free the last time it was on and DH refills a smaller container from the big jars periodically.

With the flax seed - bear in mind that the omega-3 that is in it is the C18 omega fatty acid not the the C22. The body has to convert it to the C22 for best benefit. If she can tolerate it, I think Diana's suggestion may be a better alternative.


Johanna

Caleb (aka Caleb-Moose)
Ciara(aka Ciara Belle, Black Devil)

RIP Aodhán, Rica, Max, Kelly - gone but never forgotten - forever in my heart
Re: Elsa Has HD--Glad We Got Those X-Rays [Re: Woodreb] #114798
12/14/10 10:50 PM
12/14/10 10:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,814
Belfast, NY
Good_Karma Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Good_Karma  Offline
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,814
Belfast, NY
Justine, I'm so sorry about Elsa. But that's great that she's not showing any signs of discomfort, and that you are getting her on supplements. I know you already keep her in great physical shape, so no worries there!

Can we see her x-rays? I'm just curious to see what moderate HD looks like so I can compare to Rosa.


Leah
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